Paradigm Concepts

Archangel · Joined: 15 Aug 2011 Posts: 399

Since Val'Inares are a bit of a special case I was curious about the interaction. The mechanics make it clear that it should work, but has there been any character that was a Val'Holryn that has manifested the powers of a Val'Inares? Would they transform as they age as the Val'Inares do?

Nierite · Joined: 20 Jan 2010 Posts: 1757 Location: Edmonton, Canada

It was revealed in the last campaign that no, they do not. It is only the val'Inares who change.
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Cody Bergman

aka = Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Priest of Nier (Divine 1. Cool

aka = Dyabe val'Abebi, Templar of Althares (Divine 1.4)
aka = Jorma Ostoman, Battlemage of the Coryani Empire (Arcane 1.2)

Archangel · Joined: 15 Aug 2011 Posts: 399

Nierite · Joined: 20 Jan 2010 Posts: 1757 Location: Edmonton, Canada

That is my understanding, which brings up even more interesteing things about the val'Holryn. . .
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Cody Bergman

aka = Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Priest of Nier (Divine 1. Cool

aka = Dyabe val'Abebi, Templar of Althares (Divine 1.4)
aka = Jorma Ostoman, Battlemage of the Coryani Empire (Arcane 1.2)

Archangel · Joined: 15 Aug 2011 Posts: 399

I agree the Val'Holryn are netting my interest in their chameleon style. I look forward to coming up with ideas for that in my home game as well as seeing if PCI ever publishes something revealing about it.

EricGorman · Joined: 12 Jun 2007 Posts: 435 Location: Portland OR

My main character in the last campaign was val'Holryn and I have one in this campaign as well. Questions about their origin and "patron" remain extremely interesting to me.

In a seperate thread Henry mentioned that the val'Holryn do not manifest lines that have been created after their founding ... such as the val'Sosi of the last campaign. It may be possible that they cannot become members of other lines as well (val'Baucisz spring to mind as a candidate as do the various Uls of Khitani). We know that they can use the powers of the core val families though (including the val Inares)

Henry has promisesed some clarification of what limitations may apply in future products.
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~Eisener val'Holryn. Holy Champion of Nier and haunted veteran of the crusade
~Formerly Sir Jaeger val'Holryn, gave his soul to help free King Noen from the LLT Banner

Archangel · Joined: 15 Aug 2011 Posts: 399

Well that definitely degrades my current theory as to how they came about. It doesn't destroy it but it does show some limitations.

Archangel · Joined: 15 Aug 2011 Posts: 399

I figure I'll share my conspiracy theory on the Val'Holryn here. It is also what I'll be holding as the real events in my home game.

the Val'Holryn are actually descended from the the Valinor of The Other. It would explain why only the older families are emulated as well as the diverse set of abilities, due to The Other having absorbed some of the original pantheon weakening them (as explained in the Gods War entry of Codex Arcanis)

For now I'm still trying to decide what it is that The Other was searching for, and having read the Elorii account of events, and possibly found.
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Brian Trahan

EricGorman · Joined: 12 Jun 2007 Posts: 435 Location: Portland OR

I have also considered that possibility ... but there are other options as well.

I know when Henry was dreaming up the val lines the val'Holryn were the first family he put "to ink" so I'm sure he has something special waiting for us.
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~Eisener val'Holryn. Holy Champion of Nier and haunted veteran of the crusade
~Formerly Sir Jaeger val'Holryn, gave his soul to help free King Noen from the LLT Banner

Sarishan · Joined: 05 Feb 2012 Posts: 7

EricGorman · Joined: 12 Jun 2007 Posts: 435 Location: Portland OR

No one knows where the val'Holryn came from. I wouldn't rule out that they were created by one celestrial party and defected to another ... possibly with some version of a mind wipe and a reset. Very Happy

Fleshcrafting a bunch of other vals together might also be a good way to spend a few hundred years out in Ymandragore for all we know.

For that matter its not clear to me that Belisarda couldn't have created a val line of her own once it became clear they were a superior life form to the elorii. Twisted Evil

(ducks and runs for cover!)
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~Eisener val'Holryn. Holy Champion of Nier and haunted veteran of the crusade
~Formerly Sir Jaeger val'Holryn, gave his soul to help free King Noen from the LLT Banner

Deviknyte · Joined: 17 Jun 2009 Posts: 1399 Location: Allen Park, MI

Archangel · Joined: 15 Aug 2011 Posts: 399

Nierite · Joined: 20 Jan 2010 Posts: 1757 Location: Edmonton, Canada

My personal belief is that the Holryn's are the Val's of the Other, or more accurately, of a Valinor who was (at least at one time) in the Other's service. Following the Other's eating of the "Most gentle" of the Gods, he gained the power of mimicry which is why it took the rest of the Gods to contain him.

Alternatively, he made a deal with Belisarda before the God's showed up to bring him to 'justice'. Using the powers of Belisarda to bring life to them, he created the val'Holryn as the 'Ultimate force' as they can combine all the powers of the others. When the Human Gods ate the Elemental Lords, he hid Belisarda somewhere and allowed himself to be bound and captured (maybe with some fight), but by then his children were created. . .

A thought, anyway.
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Cody Bergman

aka = Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Priest of Nier (Divine 1. Cool

aka = Dyabe val'Abebi, Templar of Althares (Divine 1.4)
aka = Jorma Ostoman, Battlemage of the Coryani Empire (Arcane 1.2)