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Deviknyte

Joined: 17 Jun 2009 Posts: 1361 Location: Allen Park, MI
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Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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Was TPK the intent here? I can see many TPKs out there. _________________ -Devin Redd, Detroit Harvester
"The Elorii shall rise again!"
Current- Vaerdos kyr'Taliis, Ardakene Elorii Chanter of the Rebirth and the Bright People
Retired- Elysian, Ardakene Elorii Hierophant of Belisarda |
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PCIHenry Site Admin

Joined: 31 Jan 2007 Posts: 946
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Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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Devin,
| Deviknyte wrote: | | Was TPK the intent here? I can see many TPKs out there. |
Com'on - you really have to ask this question?
Was the intent of the fight to TPK the party? Really?
The intent was to illustrate that the fights will be getting tougher as the Heroes increase in prowess, hence the Tier 1.5 and above specifications. _________________ Henry Lopez
President
Paradigm Concepts, Inc. |
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Harliquinn

Joined: 09 Aug 2010 Posts: 1520
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Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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Henry
That's a very good point to make and I have a question around how Tiers are handled in modules. It seems that given the very versatile nature of Arcanis's advancements, that a Tier 1.5 character who advanced one way could be very different in 'power level' from another character. By Tier 2, I imagine that most characters have taken many of the same Advancements (Generally there around 7-8 that all characters are likely to take with 2-3 personal choice ones).
For instance, a character who chose as their first 4 Advancements: 2 Skill Talents, 2 Attribute Bumps, A Path, and a +1 to all Skills would be not as 'combat' ready as someone who'd taken 2 Combat/Arcane Talents, +2 Defenses, 4 Attribute Bumps and +1 to all Skills. Is there an expectation that by the mid-point of a Tier, characters have generally taken certain Advancements in order to stay 'on par' with the adversaries they are likely to encounter.
The reason I ask is that in some games, you are fairly certain that any "5th level" character has gained 5 levels of Hit Points, 5 levels of combat advancement, and 5 levels of character abilities.
I completely understand "Choices have consequences." However, I'm curious if the PCI Team / Module Authors have some core expectations of Tier 1.5 / Tier 2.5 characters (for instance, it's generally accepted that you've taken your +2 Defenses before Tier X.5 and if you don't then you've made a choice outside the expectations of the campaign that will have consequences).
John _________________ - Harliquinn, John Bellando
Ohio Harvester
Kelb'Bakari, Dark-kin Altherian Corsair, Gentleman Archaeologist
-"Judge a wine by its label and you will miss out on the best vintages." |
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SamhainIA
Joined: 03 Apr 2010 Posts: 176
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Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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I think it would fair to say that the assumption is " people are going to take the advancements they feel will make the best impact for their character "
and what exactly those are are widely varied from build to build _________________ --Josh Elliott
Harvester of Eastern Iowa and associated Dominions |
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Harliquinn

Joined: 09 Aug 2010 Posts: 1520
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Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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| SamhainIA wrote: | I think it would fair to say that the assumption is " people are going to take the advancements they feel will make the best impact for their character "
and what exactly those are are widely varied from build to build |
That should always be the case; however, it appears that fights are getting tougher in the middle of Tier I, so there may be some unwritten expectation that characters have enhanced their combat abilities/survival by mid-tier, even if the character would feel better served by taking some additional skills, etc.
Just as I think there is a baseline assumption that all characters will take +2 Defenses every Tier as an Advancement (and not doing so is a choice with a consequence), there's probably some baseline for how 'combat ready' a character is by mid-tier.
John _________________ - Harliquinn, John Bellando
Ohio Harvester
Kelb'Bakari, Dark-kin Altherian Corsair, Gentleman Archaeologist
-"Judge a wine by its label and you will miss out on the best vintages." |
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mighty28

Joined: 13 Jun 2007 Posts: 229
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Posted: Fri May 04, 2012 10:12 pm Post subject: |
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I think it also really depends on the story. I believe the actual Tier/Rank of average Heroes playing is not the deciding factor, but what does the story call for? This mod did have a "bump" to keep things very challenging (as Henry indicated), but even a party who did not meet the requirements for said bump should still be very challenged.
Really bad stuff can happen to Heroes. Death, failure, fear. Some of it is climactic, and some isn't.
Conan ran away A LOT. He knew when he was outmatched and said "screw it, i am not fighting that!" In the original movie, he loses his love interest and truest companion...and she was a Hero, too. Sturm Brightblade...killed in battle. Flint Fireforge...killed via heart attack. Maximus (from Gladiator)...dies. Luke Skywalker loses a hand. Mace Windu...dead. Qui Gon Jin...dead. Obi Wan Kenobi...dead via sacrifice. Hell, Joss Whedon is consider a master storyteller in the geek universe and he kills Heroes in every show & movie he does.
If the PCs, as the Heroes, want to be the central component of the story, they have to risk something. The alternatives are to either be the central figures (and Henry tells us we are awesome and kill the big bad) or that we are not the central components of the story, and our actions and decisions become futile, anyway. _________________ Matthew Flinn
Indiana Harvester
tpb Marcus Decius Val'Assante
and (formerly) Mikalosh Val'Assante (no relation) |
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Deviknyte

Joined: 17 Jun 2009 Posts: 1361 Location: Allen Park, MI
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Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 2:49 am Post subject: |
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| PCIHenry wrote: | Devin,
| Deviknyte wrote: | | Was TPK the intent here? I can see many TPKs out there. |
Com'on - you really have to ask this question?
Was the intent of the fight to TPK the party? Really?
The intent was to illustrate that the fights will be getting tougher as the Heroes increase in prowess, hence the Tier 1.5 and above specifications. | I didn't mean anything by it Henry, and had the answer been yes, I would not have thought ill of anyone. The fight is a little more than hard, even accounting for the increase in our prowess (pun). And sometimes GMs, or campaigns, put the deaths out to remind players they are mortal. I asked the question because from the attitude all the posters. I completely expect deaths and I can't believe you didn't have any deaths and so on and so fourth. _________________ -Devin Redd, Detroit Harvester
"The Elorii shall rise again!"
Current- Vaerdos kyr'Taliis, Ardakene Elorii Chanter of the Rebirth and the Bright People
Retired- Elysian, Ardakene Elorii Hierophant of Belisarda |
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Nierite

Joined: 20 Jan 2010 Posts: 1724 Location: Edmonton, Canada
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Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 3:56 am Post subject: |
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And it isn't like Arcaniacs aren't used to battles where discretion is the better option... and then trying it anyway.
Lucius Orata, The Lavender Way, Voiceless One assasins, running int petrified forests.... _________________ Cody Bergman
aka = Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Priest of Nier (Divine 1.
aka = Dyabe val'Abebi, Templar of Althares (Divine 1.3)
aka = Jorma Ostoman, Battlemage of the Coryani Empire (Arcane 1.2) |
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Deviknyte

Joined: 17 Jun 2009 Posts: 1361 Location: Allen Park, MI
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Posted: Sat May 05, 2012 9:16 am Post subject: |
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| Nierite wrote: | | Lucius Orata, The Lavender Way, Voiceless One assasins, running int petrified forests.... | ::flashbacks:: _________________ -Devin Redd, Detroit Harvester
"The Elorii shall rise again!"
Current- Vaerdos kyr'Taliis, Ardakene Elorii Chanter of the Rebirth and the Bright People
Retired- Elysian, Ardakene Elorii Hierophant of Belisarda |
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Deviknyte

Joined: 17 Jun 2009 Posts: 1361 Location: Allen Park, MI
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Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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Loot questions on the Spirit Gauntlets:
Are these 2 gauntlets that share a rune or 2 gauntlets with a rune in each?
Can these runes be removed (or sold)?
Are they fine or exceptional quality runes? _________________ -Devin Redd, Detroit Harvester
"The Elorii shall rise again!"
Current- Vaerdos kyr'Taliis, Ardakene Elorii Chanter of the Rebirth and the Bright People
Retired- Elysian, Ardakene Elorii Hierophant of Belisarda |
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Nierite

Joined: 20 Jan 2010 Posts: 1724 Location: Edmonton, Canada
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Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Deviknyte wrote: | Loot questions on the Spirit Gauntlets:
Are these 2 gauntlets that share a rune or 2 gauntlets with a rune in each?
Can these gauntlet's be removed?
Are they fine or exceptional quality runes? |
Presumably 2 Gauntless, each with a Rune. Normally you can only punch with one hand, but they give the option of two-weapon fighting.
Gauntlets are worn weapons, and I can only assume that they could be removed.
At this level, I'll assume that they are Good Quality Gauntlets, with Fine Weapon Runes upon them. _________________ Cody Bergman
aka = Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Priest of Nier (Divine 1.
aka = Dyabe val'Abebi, Templar of Althares (Divine 1.3)
aka = Jorma Ostoman, Battlemage of the Coryani Empire (Arcane 1.2) |
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Deviknyte

Joined: 17 Jun 2009 Posts: 1361 Location: Allen Park, MI
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Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Nierite wrote: | | Deviknyte wrote: | Loot questions on the Spirit Gauntlets:
Are these 2 gauntlets that share a rune or 2 gauntlets with a rune in each?
Can these gauntlet's be removed?
Are they fine or exceptional quality runes? |
Presumably 2 Gauntless, each with a Rune. Normally you can only punch with one hand, but they give the option of two-weapon fighting.
Gauntlets are worn weapons, and I can only assume that they could be removed.
At this level, I'll assume that they are Good Quality Gauntlets, with Fine Weapon Runes upon them. | I had edited that. Can the runes be moved is the question. Also, you can't but a fine quality rune on a good quality weapon. _________________ -Devin Redd, Detroit Harvester
"The Elorii shall rise again!"
Current- Vaerdos kyr'Taliis, Ardakene Elorii Chanter of the Rebirth and the Bright People
Retired- Elysian, Ardakene Elorii Hierophant of Belisarda |
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Nierite

Joined: 20 Jan 2010 Posts: 1724 Location: Edmonton, Canada
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Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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I'm going to assume not, since it is a named magical item instead of just saying "A pair of gauntlets with a rune". _________________ Cody Bergman
aka = Haakon Marcus val'Virdan, Priest of Nier (Divine 1.
aka = Dyabe val'Abebi, Templar of Althares (Divine 1.3)
aka = Jorma Ostoman, Battlemage of the Coryani Empire (Arcane 1.2) |
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MaioJKM
Joined: 11 Jun 2007 Posts: 19
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Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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You can put a fine quality rune on a good weapon, just not as many as you could on a fine weapon.
Fine runes can be placed on good or fine items/weapons
Exceptional runes can be placed on on exceptional or better items
Legendary runes can only be placed on legendary items
This is all found in Forged in magic, but it is a bit confusing.
James |
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Harliquinn

Joined: 09 Aug 2010 Posts: 1520
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Posted: Sat May 26, 2012 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Nierite wrote: |
At this level, I'll assume that they are Good Quality Gauntlets, with Fine Weapon Runes upon them. |
Having just completed this adventure, I would assume they are Exceptional Quality Gauntlets with an Exceptional Quality Rune. Otherwise, the rune is rather pointless on the gauntlets, since a Fine quality Spirit Bane rune does nothing on weapons.
As for moving it, nothing in the Items Found description says it can't be moved. However, it is a named item, so it is likely possible that it cannot, making it even more likely to be an Exceptional Rune. Given the challenge of this mod (I'll leave my comments on that separately), it better be Exceptional
John _________________ - Harliquinn, John Bellando
Ohio Harvester
Kelb'Bakari, Dark-kin Altherian Corsair, Gentleman Archaeologist
-"Judge a wine by its label and you will miss out on the best vintages." |
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